Ep. 040 | Veteran Mental Health Care

Today, we chat with guest, Cody Mills, a US Army veteran and soon-to-be board-certified music therapist, about the intersection of mental health care and military culture.

TRANSCRIPT

Erica: Welcome, friends! You’re listening to The Feeling is Musical — as presented by the Snohomish County Music Project. My name is Erica Lee, and today, we are talking about Veteran mental health care, with soon-to-be board-certified music therapist Cody Mills. Cody is the student president of the Western Region of the American Music Therapy Association. He served 6 years in the US Army as a helicopter crew chief. Currently, he’s completing his music therapy internship at Cedar Hills Mental Health hospital, located in the greater area of Portland, Oregon, which serves civilians as well as military populations.

[Podcast intro music plays]

Erica: Welcome, Cody, to the podcast. Thanks so much for being here.

Cody: Thanks. It’s great to be here.

Erica: Um, to get us started, can you tell us a little bit more about yourself? How did you originally become interested in being a music therapist?

Cody: Sure. So, let’s see… I got interested in music therapy because I really love reading. I’m always trying to educate myself and just learn more about all sorts of subjects. And music has always been something I’ve loved, so I got into this stint of reading a bunch of just uh biographies of musicians - different - different like historical aspects, like I read book about Tin Pan Alley and about how all of these great artists wrote all of this music for like musicals and such in the 19 - early 1900s. Um and then I found books like Musicophilia by Oliver Sax, and then This is Your Brain on Music by Daniel Levitin. And those 2 books, you know, mentioned music therapy. And this is post uh my Army time - I spent 6 years in the Army - and around this time I was about maybe 3 or 4 years out of my military career. And so I was doing all this reading, I was working a lot, and just kinda doing some introspection. Um, and I had been playing in bands for the last couple years um on drums - I’m mainly a drummer. And so, through all this like stuff - just like, you know, what am I doing with my life? You know, just kind of like reinventing myself - um and through all the books I was reading - I started reading about music therapy. And I was like, oh wow, maybe that’s another step for me - maybe that’s the next step. And I had thought about a music - a music career, and I looked into like engineering - you know, I like tech, but then I started considering like how many hours of the day I would have to sit and stare at computer screens, and just be inside. And I just can’t do that, you know? Um, so I wanted something more interactive - something I can move - something I could interact with the people maybe. You know, I’m a mechanic by trade, so I’ve worked with a lot of inanimate objects. But I’ve always enjoyed meeting new people, and making new friends, and having different experiences, and like just learning. From each other. So this uh music therapy thing really intrigued me. So that’s kind of like the first step.

And then - this was in Idaho - I was in north Idaho living, and I started researching schools that had music therapy programs. And I started, you know - okay, there’s some on the east coast - there’s like New York - not really interested in big cities necessarily. And Texas and Kansas University - I’m actually originally from Kansas —

Erica: Mmm —

Cody: But I didn’t necessarily wanna move back there, you know?

[Erica chuckles]

Cody: So I was like, where - okay - oh, Seattle, that’s pretty close. Oh, Portland - I’ve always been interested in living in Portland, Oregon - they have a school. You know, and so I actually visited - I took a trip down to visit the campus. And I had about a year between myself actually uh going to visit and then deciding. To do it, and then I had a year between then and when I started. Like I, you know, made that decision —

Erica: Mmhmm —

Cody: Signed up for the - for the program at Marylhurst University. And yeah, so I just gave myself plenty of time, but I came - came to that decision where it was like music therapy is at least something I can sink my teeth into and keep on this journey - and keep learning. And - and it has not failed in that respect.

Erica: Yeah. It’s such a - it is such a journey to become a therapist. There are so many steps  to it —

Cody: Mmhmm —

Erica: With good reason. But yeah, it has - there’s a lot of components to get they end result. Um, can you tell us more about the type of work you’re doing at the hospital? I know you said you’re seeing adults —

Cody: Mmhmm —

Erica: What does that mean? What does that look like?

Cody: Sure —

Erica: And then, specifically for this episode, like can you tell us about the veteran care that you’re providing, and what that looks like?

Cody: Sure. So, you know, working with adults, um it’s - like I said all across the spectrum. Like, the good thing about music is it can cross boundaries of age and of - I mean, culture, race, everything, right? It’s like, if you are playing music for a group - which we are all - we’re doing groups, that’s all we do - I will have, you know, possibly an 18 year old, a 25 year old, a 35 year old, on and on, all until you get to the 60s and 70s - like in one group. And you have to be able to connect to everybody, or, you know, do your best. So what do you do? You bring out songs that people recognize or connect to, you know. So, that’s kind of like the work that I’m doing there.

I’m doing a lot of guitar work - which, drums are my primary instrument, so, you know, I’ve had to do a lot of work on guitar, and I still do. But I learn all these songs and bring them with intention to connect - intention to get people to relate to them, you know, and say, oh, I see myself in that song, or I see somebody else, or this makes me think of this, you know. So that’s what I mainly do. I do do some drum groups as well, and those are really effective because I get people to play the drums and I’m the leader so I kind of like organize it and, you know, just have that trust and leadership. And they get something out of it. Like if you’re playing a rhythm for 10 or 15 or 20 minutes, you get into a rhythm - you sync into this beautiful space, and you come out and you weren’t thinking about your problems for that 15 or 20 minutes. You were concentrating on your rhythm, your beat, your foundation - the feeling of the drum, the feeling of vibration, the things that I’m saying - so I can tell you like, okay drop the 3rd beat, now play in this rhythm. And you have to pay attention, you know - you have to constantly adjust - so that really gets people out of their head as well, which really helps.

And, specifically with the vets - so the hospital has 1 unit that is all veterans or active duty, so it’s kind of unique in that way. And so, since I’m a veteran, my supervisor encouraged me to go to that wing and start doing work with them - which is totally what I wanted to do. I mean, it was such a huge - it was like a bonus. Like, when I first uh interviewed with the hospital, I had heard that there was a veteran unit on the hospital, but I didn’t know how it was gonna work - I didn’t know what it was like, you know. And so, once I started doing that work with them, it was just so natural. Like, I just fell into just a routine, and a rhythm, and connected. I have great groups - I have all age groups - um, you know, male/female. It’s just - I can really connect with them because I have shared experience - I have a shared language. You know, the military is like a tribe: it’s its own culture. And there’s just certain things that everybody gets without having to even say anything. You know, it’s just a feeling and a - a comfortability. And it’s - getting up there and working with them, sometimes they - I’ll work with them - you know, they’re - they’re there a little longer - they’re there for about 30 days, and the rest of our clients/patients are there for 1 to 2 weeks roughly. So I see the - the military population longer. You know, I establish more rapport - just have a better relationship with them.

And yes… So what I was saying is: sometimes I will disclose that I’m a veteran - sometimes I won’t. And it doesn’t – you know, there’s no formula. It’s either natural that it comes to disclosure, or it’s not necessary, you know. And - and I’m sure they can sense like I have that connection - like it’s - like I said, kind of like a language. So it’s been really great to get over there to that - to that wing, and just connect with them and hear their stories - share in their successes and their struggles. And, you know, the - something that we talk about a lot is that the military, you know, teaches people to suppress feelings in order to stay alive and like complete the mission. You know, it’s - it’s necessary. Like, when you’re in battle, if you don’t do that, you won’t survive. But it’s hard to turn that off for some people. You know, when they come back home -when they try and reintegrate with society - when they try and become a civilian, um go to school - you know, do all these normal things [chuckles]. And - so that’s part of - part of what we work to - to help them be able to do. You know, instead of suppressing those feelings, what’s a hobby or what’s a coping  mechanism that we can help to cultivate within you that will take place of that - or take place of the drugs and alcohol, you know.

That’s work I do up there. And, yeah, it’s just been so rewarding. Like, I’ve had such great connections. You know, I just had a great session today. It’s amazing that I - I work with these people for like 3 weeks and all of a sudden they just like open up and tell me like the whole traumatic reason that they’re there. And it’s, you know, I didn’t ask for it - they just told me. And it gets to that point where they finally open up, and they can start doing the hard - the hard work. You know, it’s like a breath of fresh air. It’s just amazing. Just, beautiful moments are happening all the time. So yeah —

Erica: Yeah. That’s super cool. What an awesome experience. In your internship thus far, what have you learned - either about mental health, or maybe music therapy more generally - that surprised you, that’s new to you?

Cody: You know, before this internship, I did practicum work with stroke victims, with TBI victims, at the VA hospital —

Erica: Mmm —

Cody: Yeah, which was very rewarding. Um, where else? I was at Victory Academy, which is a school um for children with autism —

Erica: Okay —

Cody: Autistic children —

Erica: We say autistic children, yeah —

Cody: Okay. And so, I’ve had a lot of different practicum experiences, but I’ve never specifically worked in mental. And so yeah, it was not a humungous learning curve, because I feel like that’s just part of my nature. Like, I’ve always been a verbal processor - I’ve always enjoyed talking to people, and mentoring people, and just being involved in people’s like well-being.

Erica: Mmm.

Cody: And so it just comes naturally to me. And so, I’ve learned a lot, but it wasn’t, you know, totally out of left field either. You know, it’s just relating with people - it’s like just connecting.

Erica: Mmm.

Cody: But I - I mean, I have learned a lot. And so, one big thing that I’ve learned is that, you know, we can easily harm our clients in music therapy. It comes so easily. And, you know, you have to just be aware, and like constantly learning, adjusting, and then implementing your lessons. You know, it’s like, oh, I notice that this person got really agitated and left the room - what was it? Was it a song I played - was it a lyric - was it my - was it me - was it my beard? [Chuckles] You know, it could easily be my beard, and I can’t do anything about that. But, it could have been the music I was using - it could have been, oh goodness, my B string was way out of - it was like, you know, quarter tone flat - like yeah, it sounded awful. Like that’s just something I need to work on. But it harmed the client - it harmed the session - and that’s in all sessions of any type, but mental health, you know, you’re - we’re using a lot of lyrics, lyric analysis - people are already - they are scared, they’ve never been in a facility like that - they’re anxious, they’re depressed - they’re - they have - you know, I deal with people with schizophrenia - with like… So really, like, that’s something I’ve learned, and just to be aware of. You know, you can’t - it’s impossible not to harm in that kind of setting. Like, you know, it - it can just happen - but you just have to be aware and learn from each - each setting and each encounter, and just adjust. Yeah, so that’s a big lesson I learned there.

Erica: I think it’s uncomfortable for anyone to admit that they hurt somebody else —

Cody: Yes —

Erica: Or harmed somebody else —

Cody: Mmm —

Erica: Um, and I have heard in discussions with other therapists that that is a challenge. Um, and I think being able to like admit or say that you caused harm is a huge part in the process of learning.

Cody: Mmhmm.

Erica: And so I’m really glad that you brought that to the podcast, ‘cause it’s not something - it’s not something we talk about a whole ton. And the other part of that is like learning what do you do afterwards —

Cody: Mmmhmm, yeah —

Erica: How do you mend —

Cody: Yeah —

Erica: Um, depending on what the circumstances are. And that‘s why we have supervision.

Cody: Yeah.

Erica: That’s why therapists have supervisors and seek out supervision. Hopefully therapists are seeking out supervision after you finished your coursework and your internship. And - and it’s so important and goes back to that listening piece we were talking about earlier.

Cody: Yeah.

Erica: If you’re not full and present and listening to the client, you’re gonna miss out —

Cody: Absolutely —

Erica: On that opportunity to practice trauma-informed care, and to be there in the best way possible for your client.

Cody: Absolutely. Yeah, that is a big part - just being present any time you start a session. And, yeah - and that can be a challenge too, but that’s what we do. That’s what we chose, you know?

Erica: Yeah. Yeah. Let’s talk about what are some of the misconceptions in the intersection of music therapy and veteran care?

Cody: Sure. Yeah, a big one that I’ve heard from fellow students when I was in my coursework is that they have a misconception that all veterans are like war-hardened, you know, just combat - you know, trauma - [chuckles] they like Rambo. Like, okay, that’s not true at all. The military is a community. I mean, a base is a city. It’s - it can survive without the outside cities. And so, you have to have support, you have to have logistics, cooks um [chuckles] like mechanics - like, I was a mechanic, you know. So that’s a - that is a misconception that I’ve heard from fellow students. Um, and it’s just - it’s just an ignorance, and that’s fine, we’re all ignorant about something.

But there’s - that’s a big one, I think. And then, another one would be you know, they’re all just kind of macho and have this um mentality, you know, that has been drilled into them and - and all this stuff, like kind of a Rambo-esque - like, yes, there are - or like a - a lone person - a lone wolf, you know, that kind of mentality I think. And those aren’t true. Like, yes, there are those people - there’s those people that have never been in the military as well. You know, like I think human nature is to label things - like that’s how we have survived, you know, all this time, but to understand that military members are just people that have chosen that as their career field. And a lot of times, you know, they’ve entered in the military really young - you know, I entered in before I was even 18 years old - like, as soon as I was done with high school, like a month later, I was in the service, you know. And, for one, our brains are not fully developed at that point, so then we’re going through all the training - very possibly deploying before you’re even 20 years old, you know, going off to war. Um I deployed when I was 24 - so I went to Afghanistan for a year - and so these experiences, you know, like um shape us. And so I think misconceptions are just, you know, someone’s trauma is from war as well. Which is not the case. A lot of times, someone’s trauma, even if they’re in the military, it could be a military sexual trauma - male/female doesn’t matter. You know, it could be a training accident, you know, it could be a stress related accident, it could be drugs and alcohol, marital trauma.

So, I think those are all misconceptions of military members, you know, and - and I see it every time I’m in the hospital, you know, dealing with these military members and veterans and active duty. I met a gentleman that - he was shipped off - I don’t know if he went to Vietnam or not, but he said that he was so traumatized by just his training in basic training, you know, and he’s like - you know, you look at his eyes and he’s like the kindest man you ever met. You know, he’s just like very, you know, docile and just very kind and gentle.

[Erica chuckles.]

Cody: I don’t know why he entered the military —

Erica: Mmm —

Cody: But a lot of people go in because the benefits —

Erica: Mmm —

Cody: And that’s a big reason I entered. You know, I - I was able to pay for my music therapy education with my GI Bill, you know. And so, that was a huge push for me to do that. And some people want to get out of their houses - maybe it’s a toxic environment and they’re like getting abused, so they go off to the military. You know, those are all sorts of reasons. So, I don’t know, I - those are all misconceptions, um - and also, I think that a misconception that, even in our hospital, is that they are all just like one big group, and they are not gonna participate in some of this activity stuff - you know, like art therapy or music therapy —

Erica: Mmm —

Cody: And they’re just not gonna be interested in this - they’re gonna think it’s stupid. That’s not. True, you know. But I mean, you go up and they’re all like in one big pack, you know, and it’s intimidating to try and like separate the pack. And, you know, you start to peel off some of the people, hey come over! And then one - one person gets another person - all of a sudden you got 10 people in your group. So that - that’s probably not a misconception —

[Erica chuckles]

Cody: That’s - that’s, you know —

Erica: Yeah —

Cody: That’s held pretty true because it is … [word is distorted] But you can get them to participate - they’re - they’re there because they wanna get better.

Erica: Mmm.

Cody: And uh they’re so supportive of one another. You know, that’s the -that’s the thing. Like, they’re just - they may only know you for a day, but if you served in the same kind of organization as they did, you have a connection. So yeah.

Erica: Mmm, yeah. What are some of the obstacles to veterans seeking support?

Cody: Mmhmm. Number one would be themselves.

Erica: Can you tell me more? What do you mean?

Cody: [Chuckles]. So, I mean, veterans have so much support. Like, I mean, it - it does depend on how they were discharged, it depends on how much they’ve kept in contact with the VA. But there’s so much support - there’s so many ways to get help - you know, there’s so many organizations. Um, we have a suicide hotline, we have a um different mental health crisis hotlines, we have veterans’ hospitals across the nation. You know, we have things that aren’t even related to the VA that support veterans. You know, there’s music groups, there’s men’s support groups, um - one big thing actually can be that people don’t feel worthy to receive the help and support. So that’s an unfortunate thing because, you know, these people have served their country - they’ve done all these amazing things and got injured, and, you know, but they still don’t feel like they deserve - you know, maybe they didn’t do a - maybe they didn’t deploy, you know. It’s all these thoughts - maybe I - you know, I don’t deserve that. So that can be a big thing to that people don’t reach out for help.

Erica: Sure —

Cody: So, yeah.

Erica: Um, what would you tell veterans that are struggling to ask for help? What would you want them to know?

Cody: Um, you know, I’d want them to know that they should utilize the benefits and resources that they have been um that they have earned. You know, you’ve earned everything that you have received, you might as well use it. And, even if you don’t have benefits - say if you’re dishonorably discharged, or less than honorably, or have a felony or whatever - like you don’t think that you’re eligible - you don’t know until you talk to somebody. Call the VA, um, yes it can be a pain sometimes - you might wait a month to get a response for some things - like, it’s a pain - you lost your paperwork, it’s a pain. Until you take those steps, you just don’t know what’s gonna happen. And it could just be one more excuse that you’re putting in your own way. So, you know, do the hard work, because you have to - you have to decide whether you’re gonna be unhappy, or take a next step and see if that can bring you, you know, um one step closer to your wellness.

Erica: Mmm.

Cody: Um, but yeah —

Erica: Yeah —

Cody: Reach - reach out. You know, there’s - there’s resources. The VA, um DAV, your local veteran community center, you know, the VFW, fellow veterans, you know - find somebody on Facebook - find somebody in your social network. One of those people has a connection, you know, they can put you on the right path. But um, yeah, just know that people are there to support you, and they want you to get better.

Erica: Yeah. And I wanna underline: for anybody listening - veteran or otherwise - that you are absolutely worthy and deserving —

Cody: Mmhmm —

Erica: Of support. And it’s okay to ask for help.

Cody: Yeah.

Erica: Um, we can’t say that - I mean, I could say it louder, but it’d hurt your microphone. But like, you cannot - I cannot - I cannot emphasize that enough —

Cody: Yeah, absolutely —

Erica: To anybody listening. It - it doesn’t matter where you come from —

Cody: Mmhmm —

Erica: What you’ve done, what your’re going through. It’s okay to ask for help.

Cody: Yeah.

Erica: And you deserve help. Just by the virtue of being a human, it’s okay to ask for help.

Cody: Absolutely.

Erica: Cody, do you have any closing thoughts as we’re wrapping up this episode? Anything that we haven’t talked about that you would like to share?

Cody: Well, I think that I’d like to say how much I appreciate your guys’ podcast, you know, supporting the music therapy community. You know, we all - what - what you just said, like, we all have to stick together - we all have to support each other. We’re only going to improve the field through, you know, uh supporting each other, and taking the steps that are necessary - getting into positions of leadership. We all need to like step up and kinda be the change we wanna see in the world. And it’s not that big of a commitment. Like, you just have to get in there and be a little passionate - be organized, and - and help make the field better, you know. So, I would say get involved - you know, advocacy, um leadership positions - even your local school board. Yeah, that’s how we’re gonna keep this going.

Erica: Yeah, absolutely. If you are listening to this episode and you would like to know more about the Music Project, or read the transcript, it is all on our website at S as in Sam, C as in Cat Music Project dot org (scmusicproject.org). You are welcome and encouraged to connect with us on social media - we are everywhere @SCMusicProject. Encourage you to subscribe, follow along, leave us a review - share with people you know. I always say this: we don’t talk to talk to ourselves or to talk to people that we already know, we are here as a resource to help other people learn about music therapy. There’s so many different ways to access healing, and we’re so very honored and privileged to say like music is super cool. And so check us out.

Thank you, Cody, so much for takin time out of your day and - and doing this. We appreciate your wisdom and expertise, and just sharing about what you do.

Cody: Absolutely. Thank you, Erica. That was great.

Erica: Absolutely. Thank you, listeners, for listening. And we’ll talk to you next time.

[Podcast outro music plays.]